The refugee crisis in Europe -

TacoCat

TacoCat

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I'm having a debate with myself about the refugee crisis. This thread is for those who follow the news about refugees in Europe.

There is huge outrage from public especially in my country about the refugees that are being sent here. All I see on Facebook and in Media is about how horrible they are, throwing out food that has been provided by volunteers, organizing huge riots in Hungary yelling "Allah akbar" and "Fuck you Europe".

I'm trying to keep a neutral opinion on this and trying to not let myself go into a blind hate towards the refugees.

The interesting part that I find about this is that before this there was news about the war in Ukraine, but now it just went silent, like in a day. Like nothing happens there anymore, but that is not true. There is still war. Could this refugee thing be a some kind of cover-up, a diversion to get the people attention to the refugees not other things that matter, like the war there?

I find it very suspicious that a huge event like the war in Ukraine just went silent and was replaced with the refugee crisis.

Do you guys have any opinions on this? Could this be a huge media manipulation?
 
As someone whose parents were political refugees, that's enough reasons to deport them back to their home country. People like that will only bring trouble to whatever country their in.
 
My only problem with them is that I think most of them are quite religious. I got nothing good to say about Islam. How peaceful the religion is can be ascertained by looking at Islamic conquests centuries ago.

Call that a peaceful religion if you will.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muslim_conquests
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ottoman_wars_in_Europe
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_State_of_Iraq_and_the_Levant

I'm not ignorant saying that muslims are animals and eat this and that. I leave that non-sense to media. I'm having trouble with Islam and what it makes people become. Also if you poked your nose into an English translated Q'uran, you'd see the hate it has written towards non-religious/followers of other religions. You probably also know that how often they have to attend their temples where they read these hateful pages to children. You can see the kids and their parents attending mosques often in their religious outfit. Nice way to indoctrinate your kinds to hate others outside of Islam for countless generations.

If it were me for I'd outlaw both Islam, Christianity and Judaism as well. They've contributed nothing towards humanity, only hate, wars, murders and diversity.

All the shit that Christians make up nowadays are nothing but poor PR attempts to make the religion look better. The pope is a clown as well. https://www.washingtonpost.com/worl...330572-5345-11e5-b225-90edbd49f362_story.html

Then there's one of the old pope's which has apologised for the crusades. http://www.theguardian.com/world/2000/mar/13/catholicism.religion. They had basically said we killed lots of you infidels but it was a bit wrong, but that's what our bible and priests used to encourage. Sorry.

Another kind of bullshit is that the Bible holds both the old and new testament. If you poked in the old testament, you'd question the validity of that religion. Of course, priests only read from the "better excerpts" of the new testament. http://www.evilbible.com/Murder.htm

http://www.godhatestheworld.com/

Rant over.
 
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My problem is that it is such a complicated subject and people are scared of having a proper conversation about it. Secondly various immigration / asylum laws are being flouted by the governments in Europe to just panda to the bleeding heart lefties.

Most the migrants transiting through Europe are economic migrants and not genuine refugees.

I am totally in favour of helping the genuine refugees out, but not those who are just pretending to be refugees and making matters worse for everyone.

In my head it should work like this, it is also the law....

Refugee / Migrant arrives in first EU country, it is then for the government to determine whether they in genuine need of asylum or not. The ones that are stay in that country, the ones that are not are deported.
We can't have a situation where every man and his goat just pack their bags and head for Europe which is more or less what is beginning to happen.

Sadly this is not happening and we have this silly campaign #refugeeswelcome which just encourages everyone, it is not sustainable and making resources for those in real need less available.
 
Stephen said:
In my head it should work like this, it is also the law....

Refugee / Migrant arrives in first EU country, it is then for the government to determine whether they in genuine need of asylum or not. The ones that are stay in that country, the ones that are not are deported.
We can't have a situation where every man and his goat just pack their bags and head for Europe which is more or less what is beginning to happen.
Click to expand...

I'm in mobile right now, so I'll outline with links etc, later...
But that is exactly how it works in Germany.

::emp::
 
I'm sure Charles Martel might have some words on the subject.

I'll paraphrase one of the most accurate quotes I've heard on fundamentalist Islam, "Islam is superior to all other religions when it comes to engaging in warfare. They use everything for war, including the womb."

People should consider that last sentence quite thoroughly. There's a lot of historical context there in terms of Islam's past conquests across Asia, Europe, and Africa, as well as engaging in "population warfare".
 
I will do as promised and outline the process a refugee goes through in Germany.

I am simply trying to outline the political and official process, apart from any political or religious views.
Trying to keep myself out of this, basically.​

Simple fact:
I don't know enough about other places laws in these situations, so if you're from anywhere else in Europe, go ahead and fill them in.

Starting point: The Universal Declaration of Human Rights
The full text can be found here at the United Nations - page for the declaration of human rights.
We are interested in Article 14
Article 14.
  • (1) Everyone has the right to seek and to enjoy in other countries asylum from persecution.
  • (2) This right may not be invoked in the case of prosecutions genuinely arising from non-political crimes or from acts contrary to the purposes and principles of the United Nations.
Click to expand...
Please regard how this only guarantees the right to seek asylum. It does not mean a state has to grant it.

The right for Asylum for politically persecuted individuals is actually a part of the German constitution.
In everyday law, Germany takes the definition of the Geneva 1951 Refugee Convention into accord.
Asylum will be granted to people persecuted because of:
  • "Race"
  • Religion
  • Nationality
  • Membership to a social group
  • political reasons
The German way
Once a refugee contacts the autorities in Germany (however he arrived, be it by train, car, plane, on foot...)
He has the right to request asylum. "Asylantrag"

From this moment on, he is considered a potential asylant, the process of finding out whether or not Germany will actually grant asylum is started.

During this (which can actually take from 2 days to 1 year), the asylant will be living in a home for asylants "Asylantenheim" or "Asylantenunterkunft" for the first 3 months, often longer.

During the first three months, any support will be given in form of material goods. Shelter, food and clothes.
After that, the asylants are given money (close to welfare, no riches here) if they need it (determined by court).

Most of them do, as a refugee who is not given a resident permit is not allowed to work.
This is true for anyone who is still in the process of getting his request "Antrag" evaluated.

The 2%
The average number of requests for asylum that are granted lies at 2%.

The 98%
Get sent back.

..and then?
If you are granted asylum in Germany, this does not mean you get to stay, either.
Asylum is a time-limited protection. As soon as the department for foreign affairs deems a nation safe again, people are sent back.

As a rule of thumb, a lot of refugees return home before that, as they often deem their nation to be safe enough again before the German state does.

Conclusion
It isn't that easy to actually get asylum in Germany.

::emp::
 
@turbin3, I totally agree. I lived in a Muslim country for 6 months and, after that, I'll never live in a muslim country ever again.

  1. Islamic countries have no separation of church and state. This is a *big* problem if you're used to living in a secular country.
  2. Marrying an Muslim in an Islamic country will mean that the non-Muslim has to convert to Islam.
  3. Alcohol's heavily taxed.
  4. No drugs. It doesn't mean that there's no drug use in Islamic countries, it just means that the problem never receives the attention it needs.
  5. There's no casual sex in Islamic countries.

I can go on and on but, simply put, Islam is not a very tolerant, accepting, or free religion. Nothing that should exist in 2015.

The problem with accepting a lot of foreign muslims into a democracy is that, if there's enough of them, they'll start electing muslim politicians and enacting muslim laws. Don't believe me? This problem is already happening in Belgium. Most muslims marry someone from their home country, so, once they come, more will follow.

I haven't watched the news lately but it sounds dumb that European countries are taking in huge influxes of mostly unskilled, uneducated individuals. They're just asking for problems 20-40 years from now.

Switzerland does a good job IMO of staying stable. They're strict as hell and that's helped them avoid the refugee problem. Only 450 refugees applied to Switzerland.
 
@Philip J. Fry - I live in Switzerland, so I got some info on that, as well.

Those 450 are only Syrians (according to the article). Switzerland has people looking for asylum from everywhere.

Taken from here (German, sorry) http://www.amnesty.ch/de/themen/asy...ok/2012/asylpolitik-schweiz-zahlen-und-fakten

in 2014,
23'756 people have requested asylum in Switzerland (it'll be more this year)
and
6'199 got asylum granted
That is 26% of asylum seekers who got approved..
With another 7'924 taken in temporarily.

In 2014, 3'819 of the asylum seekers where from Syria already (according to amnesty).

The official Stats for august 2015 only show "people in the process" in Switzerland.
--> https://www.bfm.admin.ch/dam/data/b...asylstatistik/monat/2015/stat-mt-201508-d.pdf

Here, 7'193 Syrians are listed.

I'd highly doubt that 450 people figure.

::emp::
 
The far left in Europe is suicidal. They want to let everyone in(both economic migrants and actual refugees), without any consideration as to how that affects their society. Germany especially is promising to take in 800,000 refugees, which is insane.

I'm an immigrant myself(South Asian) and I think bringing in hundreds of thousands of unskilled Muslim men is an incredibly stupid idea.

There's a vast chasm of difference between an educated Muslim engineer immigrating into a country, and a horde of unskilled and potentially radical Muslims who will not integrate into the country they are going into. The first is beneficial to the host country typically, while the second is just going to result in major issues.
 
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